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	<title>Comments on: News Digital boss: We don&#8217;t hate bloggers</title>
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	<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099</link>
	<description>Everything under Australia’s media, marketing &#38; entertainment umbrella</description>
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		<title>By: Ben Barren - Confessions of a Mad Man &#187; Which Parasites Can Newspapers Blame for Their Demise ?</title>
		<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099#comment-12521</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben Barren - Confessions of a Mad Man &#187; Which Parasites Can Newspapers Blame for Their Demise ?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Aug 2009 07:51:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mumbrella.com.au/?p=8099#comment-12521</guid>
		<description>[...] - and I seem to be using that word in this post alot, the newspapers online are having to become alot more like the parasites they detest; The home page for News Ltd News.com.au, or Fairfax&#8217;s TheAge.com.au or SMH.com.au - are [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] &#8211; and I seem to be using that word in this post alot, the newspapers online are having to become alot more like the parasites they detest; The home page for News Ltd News.com.au, or Fairfax&#8217;s TheAge.com.au or SMH.com.au &#8211; are [...]</p>
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		<title>By: John Grono</title>
		<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099#comment-11855</link>
		<dc:creator>John Grono</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Aug 2009 11:12:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mumbrella.com.au/?p=8099#comment-11855</guid>
		<description>Yes Smithee, there is research to support anything if you look hard enough - so I encourage you to keep looking to find a scintilla of support.

Regarding the sources you provided links to, I thought we were talking about Australia and not New Zealand or the UK - both substantially different markets and cultures.   Why not make comparisons to Zimbabwe - I hear politicians rate well there ... or else!

I also notice that the NZ source is that well-respected bastion of research - Reader&#039;s Digest - no methodology, sample size or actual data provided.   Talk about laughter being the best medicine!   At least for the UK, Ipsos Mori is a resepected research company, with a sample sie of n=1981 (vs. Morgan&#039;s phone poll of n=687).

Further, I notice neither of the other sources reported on where advertising professionals rate.   Maybe the headline should read &quot;Journalists trusted 50% more than advertising people&quot; ... and I think various comments posted here would go a long way to explain why.   As a researcher one learns to park one&#039;s preconceptions and not hunt for or fabricate the data to support your own case.

Finally for the record, I am NOT trying to defend the integrity of journalists, but merely reporting the latest Australian data to hand without qualification or interpretation, as is my professional and ethical responsibility as a member (and Qualified Practicing Market Researcher) of the Australian Market and Social Research Society.   And no, I do not work for Morgan and I have never worked for Morgan.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes Smithee, there is research to support anything if you look hard enough &#8211; so I encourage you to keep looking to find a scintilla of support.</p>
<p>Regarding the sources you provided links to, I thought we were talking about Australia and not New Zealand or the UK &#8211; both substantially different markets and cultures.   Why not make comparisons to Zimbabwe &#8211; I hear politicians rate well there &#8230; or else!</p>
<p>I also notice that the NZ source is that well-respected bastion of research &#8211; Reader&#8217;s Digest &#8211; no methodology, sample size or actual data provided.   Talk about laughter being the best medicine!   At least for the UK, Ipsos Mori is a resepected research company, with a sample sie of n=1981 (vs. Morgan&#8217;s phone poll of n=687).</p>
<p>Further, I notice neither of the other sources reported on where advertising professionals rate.   Maybe the headline should read &#8220;Journalists trusted 50% more than advertising people&#8221; &#8230; and I think various comments posted here would go a long way to explain why.   As a researcher one learns to park one&#8217;s preconceptions and not hunt for or fabricate the data to support your own case.</p>
<p>Finally for the record, I am NOT trying to defend the integrity of journalists, but merely reporting the latest Australian data to hand without qualification or interpretation, as is my professional and ethical responsibility as a member (and Qualified Practicing Market Researcher) of the Australian Market and Social Research Society.   And no, I do not work for Morgan and I have never worked for Morgan.</p>
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		<title>By: Smithee</title>
		<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099#comment-11842</link>
		<dc:creator>Smithee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Aug 2009 10:20:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mumbrella.com.au/?p=8099#comment-11842</guid>
		<description>Here&#039;s one where journos are last - at least it says &quot;telemarketers&quot; = that&#039;s journos these days isn;t it ?
http://www.readersdigest.co.nz/content/new-zealands-most-trusted-professions-2009/
Amazingly enough they&#039;re higher than politicians !

Here they&#039;re almost in a dead-heat in last place with politicians:
http://www.marketresearchworld.net/index.php?option=com_content&amp;task=view&amp;id=1942&amp;Itemid=77

Can&#039;t find the one I&#039;m thinking of atm...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s one where journos are last &#8211; at least it says &#8220;telemarketers&#8221; = that&#8217;s journos these days isn;t it ?<br />
<a href="http://www.readersdigest.co.nz/content/new-zealands-most-trusted-professions-2009/" rel="nofollow">http://www.readersdigest.co.nz.....ions-2009/</a><br />
Amazingly enough they&#8217;re higher than politicians !</p>
<p>Here they&#8217;re almost in a dead-heat in last place with politicians:<br />
<a href="http://www.marketresearchworld.net/index.php?option=com_content&#038;task=view&#038;id=1942&#038;Itemid=77" rel="nofollow">http://www.marketresearchworld.....;Itemid=77</a></p>
<p>Can&#8217;t find the one I&#8217;m thinking of atm&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Smithee</title>
		<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099#comment-11841</link>
		<dc:creator>Smithee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Aug 2009 10:11:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mumbrella.com.au/?p=8099#comment-11841</guid>
		<description>Ho hum. So you take Roy Morgan as the bees knees of research ? There&#039;s other research which support the &quot;journos last&quot; view and has for decades as I said. The Guardian I think. Google will reveal all. Anyway, the essence is unchanged: a large percentage of the the public think journos are untrustworthy slime - and of course they&#039;re right.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ho hum. So you take Roy Morgan as the bees knees of research ? There&#8217;s other research which support the &#8220;journos last&#8221; view and has for decades as I said. The Guardian I think. Google will reveal all. Anyway, the essence is unchanged: a large percentage of the the public think journos are untrustworthy slime &#8211; and of course they&#8217;re right.</p>
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		<title>By: Ben Shepherd</title>
		<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099#comment-11454</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben Shepherd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Jul 2009 03:51:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mumbrella.com.au/?p=8099#comment-11454</guid>
		<description>Smithee - maybe you should fact check ...

&quot;The fact that for *decades* journalists have been ranked below used-car salesmen for “trustworthiness” entirely escapes their notice.&quot;

Can we be as ruthless and harsh on your lack of checking out real data before making a general claim

BTW cheers John for the Chris Anderson hook up. Whoa ... he takes douche to a new level.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Smithee &#8211; maybe you should fact check &#8230;</p>
<p>&#8220;The fact that for *decades* journalists have been ranked below used-car salesmen for “trustworthiness” entirely escapes their notice.&#8221;</p>
<p>Can we be as ruthless and harsh on your lack of checking out real data before making a general claim</p>
<p>BTW cheers John for the Chris Anderson hook up. Whoa &#8230; he takes douche to a new level.</p>
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		<title>By: John Grono</title>
		<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099#comment-11453</link>
		<dc:creator>John Grono</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Jul 2009 03:44:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mumbrella.com.au/?p=8099#comment-11453</guid>
		<description>Not defending journos Smithee - I&#039;ve had my faor share of run-ins with them over the years.   I&#039;m just pointing out the facts.

Headline to read &quot;Journalists marginally more trustworthy than used car salesmen and advertising people&quot; ... in the interests of getting the facts and the balance right ... and we have a deal.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not defending journos Smithee &#8211; I&#8217;ve had my faor share of run-ins with them over the years.   I&#8217;m just pointing out the facts.</p>
<p>Headline to read &#8220;Journalists marginally more trustworthy than used car salesmen and advertising people&#8221; &#8230; in the interests of getting the facts and the balance right &#8230; and we have a deal.</p>
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		<title>By: Smithee</title>
		<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099#comment-11452</link>
		<dc:creator>Smithee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Jul 2009 03:39:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mumbrella.com.au/?p=8099#comment-11452</guid>
		<description>@John Grono 
John, if you&#039;re trying to defend the trustworthiness of journalists you&#039;ve just been stamped with a big FAIL 

Let&#039;s revise the headline: &quot;Journalists marginally more trustworthy than used car salesmen.&quot; Doesn&#039;t sound any better to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@John Grono<br />
John, if you&#8217;re trying to defend the trustworthiness of journalists you&#8217;ve just been stamped with a big FAIL </p>
<p>Let&#8217;s revise the headline: &#8220;Journalists marginally more trustworthy than used car salesmen.&#8221; Doesn&#8217;t sound any better to me.</p>
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		<title>By: Ben Shepherd</title>
		<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099#comment-11444</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben Shepherd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Jul 2009 03:09:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mumbrella.com.au/?p=8099#comment-11444</guid>
		<description>rule #1  - never let actual data get in the way of a good story</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>rule #1  &#8211; never let actual data get in the way of a good story</p>
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		<title>By: John Grono</title>
		<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099#comment-11441</link>
		<dc:creator>John Grono</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Jul 2009 02:58:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mumbrella.com.au/?p=8099#comment-11441</guid>
		<description>STOP PRESS
===========

June 2009 Morgan data on the Image of Professions.   Last is &#039;car salesmen&#039; = 3% (rated high or very high).   Second last is &#039;advertising people&#039; = 6%.   Third last is &#039;newspaper journalists&#039; = 9%.   Last time I checked 9% was higher than 3% - so much for fact-checking.

Also, looking at the data since 1979, used-car salesmen have NEVER rated higher than journalists.   As a matter of fact for the 28 years of data I have, there are only 7 instances where journalists failed to rate higher than advertising people.   Pot ... meet the black kettle.

And if you REALLY want to see arrogance redfined, do a search for Chris Anderson&#039;s (Wired&#039;s editor - as reported by Henry Blodget in Silicon Valley Insider&#039;s &#039;The Business Insider&#039;) interview with Jim Spiegel to discuss the media world, in which Spiegel refuses to even use the words &#039;journalist&#039;, &#039;news&#039; or &#039;media&#039;.   Quite hysterical really - apart from the fact the apparently Spiegel was serious!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>STOP PRESS<br />
===========</p>
<p>June 2009 Morgan data on the Image of Professions.   Last is &#8216;car salesmen&#8217; = 3% (rated high or very high).   Second last is &#8216;advertising people&#8217; = 6%.   Third last is &#8216;newspaper journalists&#8217; = 9%.   Last time I checked 9% was higher than 3% &#8211; so much for fact-checking.</p>
<p>Also, looking at the data since 1979, used-car salesmen have NEVER rated higher than journalists.   As a matter of fact for the 28 years of data I have, there are only 7 instances where journalists failed to rate higher than advertising people.   Pot &#8230; meet the black kettle.</p>
<p>And if you REALLY want to see arrogance redfined, do a search for Chris Anderson&#8217;s (Wired&#8217;s editor &#8211; as reported by Henry Blodget in Silicon Valley Insider&#8217;s &#8216;The Business Insider&#8217;) interview with Jim Spiegel to discuss the media world, in which Spiegel refuses to even use the words &#8216;journalist&#8217;, &#8216;news&#8217; or &#8216;media&#8217;.   Quite hysterical really &#8211; apart from the fact the apparently Spiegel was serious!</p>
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		<title>By: Smithee</title>
		<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099#comment-11416</link>
		<dc:creator>Smithee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 23:18:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mumbrella.com.au/?p=8099#comment-11416</guid>
		<description>I love it whern these guys try to write their own material. They just can&#039;t see the amazing arrogance that oozes out from their corporate world-view. Freudentstein talking about bloggers has the same tone as the Emporer Nero announcing he has nothing against Christians.

The fact that for *decades* journalists have been ranked below used-car salesmen for &quot;trustworthiness&quot; entirely escapes their notice. They have this puffed-up view of themselves as upholders of truth and freedom as if they&#039;re some kind of Superman figure. But the public do not like and do not trust the media.

And if News Ltd really believes it&#039;s fair to pay for content, perhaps they might like to start paying all their so-called &quot;interns&quot; who keep their online operations going. 

And start paying the public for their pictures and videos.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love it whern these guys try to write their own material. They just can&#8217;t see the amazing arrogance that oozes out from their corporate world-view. Freudentstein talking about bloggers has the same tone as the Emporer Nero announcing he has nothing against Christians.</p>
<p>The fact that for *decades* journalists have been ranked below used-car salesmen for &#8220;trustworthiness&#8221; entirely escapes their notice. They have this puffed-up view of themselves as upholders of truth and freedom as if they&#8217;re some kind of Superman figure. But the public do not like and do not trust the media.</p>
<p>And if News Ltd really believes it&#8217;s fair to pay for content, perhaps they might like to start paying all their so-called &#8220;interns&#8221; who keep their online operations going. </p>
<p>And start paying the public for their pictures and videos.</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099#comment-11369</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 07:59:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mumbrella.com.au/?p=8099#comment-11369</guid>
		<description>I think what we find is as bloggers grow in influence, there is a self-imposed ethics behind their content... we see it everyday in our leading blogs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think what we find is as bloggers grow in influence, there is a self-imposed ethics behind their content&#8230; we see it everyday in our leading blogs.</p>
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		<title>By: John Grono</title>
		<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099#comment-11363</link>
		<dc:creator>John Grono</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 07:41:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mumbrella.com.au/?p=8099#comment-11363</guid>
		<description>Good to see you sticking to journalistic principles Tim, rather than sticking to the journalist&#039;s principals.

And Ben ... very nice!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good to see you sticking to journalistic principles Tim, rather than sticking to the journalist&#8217;s principals.</p>
<p>And Ben &#8230; very nice!</p>
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		<title>By: Ben</title>
		<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099#comment-11328</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 04:07:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mumbrella.com.au/?p=8099#comment-11328</guid>
		<description>Bumper sticker &quot;Is that the truth or is your News Limited&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bumper sticker &#8220;Is that the truth or is your News Limited&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: RAC</title>
		<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099#comment-11325</link>
		<dc:creator>RAC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 03:41:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mumbrella.com.au/?p=8099#comment-11325</guid>
		<description>&quot;Many bloggers write up rumours and half-truths as fact.&quot; Some journos devote their careers to this!  I&#039;ve lost count of the amount of times a journo has gotten it wrong (and on occasion even knew they were writing half-truths) when reporting on clients or brands I&#039;ve worked with. And what&#039;s more, thinking you can get a correction is laughable.  At least if a blogger gets something wrong it can be corrected almost immediately.  Richard, surrender the fantasy that journalistic principles still exist for all journalists.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Many bloggers write up rumours and half-truths as fact.&#8221; Some journos devote their careers to this!  I&#8217;ve lost count of the amount of times a journo has gotten it wrong (and on occasion even knew they were writing half-truths) when reporting on clients or brands I&#8217;ve worked with. And what&#8217;s more, thinking you can get a correction is laughable.  At least if a blogger gets something wrong it can be corrected almost immediately.  Richard, surrender the fantasy that journalistic principles still exist for all journalists.</p>
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		<title>By: mumbrella</title>
		<link>http://mumbrella.com.au/news-digital-boss-we-dont-hate-bloggers-8099#comment-11304</link>
		<dc:creator>mumbrella</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 02:30:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mumbrella.com.au/?p=8099#comment-11304</guid>
		<description>Hi Duncan,

Yes, the text of the speech was provided (although I still should have amended that for the right version of principle). I won&#039;t change it in the above though, as your comment would then be a bit confusing for anyone who arrives later...

Cheers,

Tim</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Duncan,</p>
<p>Yes, the text of the speech was provided (although I still should have amended that for the right version of principle). I won&#8217;t change it in the above though, as your comment would then be a bit confusing for anyone who arrives later&#8230;</p>
<p>Cheers,</p>
<p>Tim</p>
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