Dynamic Duos: ‘Our careers have been utterly entangled for more than 30 years’
This week in Dynamic Duos, Forethought's executive chairman and founder, Ken Roberts, and joint managing director, Diane Shelton, talk about their over 30 year working relationship where they worked with, and for, one another, and why Diane came out of 'retirement' to re-join the market research company.
In Dynamic Duos, Mumbrella each week asks two colleagues with a professional and personal affiliation to share with readers the importance of workplace relationships in an increasingly hybridised world of work.
Ken Roberts:
Marketing research is what brought Di and I together in the 1990s. We were both working as academics at separate G8 Australian Universities when we were recruited to the same insights firm – and our careers have been utterly entangled for more than 30 years since. I have remained an insights supplier whereas Di has slipped across the border to client side and back four times. On three of those occasions I worked for Di: at Coles and NBN here in Australia, and Southeastern Grocers in the US. Similarly, Di has had three stints at Forethought where for four years, she was the CEO and (objectively) the best in the company’s history at that.
Recently, Di has ‘come out of retirement’ to re-join Forethought. During ‘retirement’ she completed building a new home and travelled the depth and breadth of the planet. Then four months ago, much to my and everyone at Forethought’s great delight, Di got itchy feet and decided to return to us as joint managing director. She has made an immediate difference.
I am sincerely humbled to work with Di and honoured to call her a friend. I hope that this current stint at Forethought will last until Di decides again to stop working. I hope that Di and I can finish our marketing research careers as we started them – together.
Diane Shelton:
Ken came into my life more than 30 years ago now. I was working as an academic and out of the blue I was introduced to a world and a career that I had never even heard of: market research. I immediately loved it.
Ken is a huge personality. He is intense, extremely bright, and phenomenally good with clients. He thrived on the complex and was always moving and thinking at a pace that left most dizzy (nothing has changed there). I learnt my craft in that first role where Ken was a major player in directing, cajoling and at times demanding performance – always with the focus on winning and delivering the best to the client. We immediately understood how to work together. I was exhilarated operating and learning in this new high-energy world with Ken.
Ken’s commitment and focus and pace were infectious for me. He would ask and do the impossible almost daily. Programs of work that I would have seen occurring in an academic environment over months he was driving to brilliant completion in weeks. And he always knew that he would deliver. I was a tad more cautious and remember many times where we were running down to the line to hit delivery (working round the clock, in planes and taxis) but he was always right. We made it, and our clients loved it.
One really important thing about working with Ken was that he never asked of me anything that he was not also doing himself: there was no project that we worked on where he issued directions and expected superhuman efforts where he was not putting in that much himself. He was in the fray with me.
Ken on Diane:
Most memorable moment with Diane: I have watched Di nurture and develop the careers of numerous colleagues, both senior and junior. Most notably, Di has managed to flush out from female colleagues the residue of social and cultural norms that have some women believing they are not worthy. I have observed these colleagues go from stooping to standing tall and then succeeding in leadership roles. It does come at a cost: if you work for Di, then you should know that her expectations of you will be high. Not everyone can live up to those expectations but Di is like a great team coach where she is constantly ‘going to the draft’ to bolster the ranks of team and, at the same time, counselling those who fall short of her expectations. Without ever being nasty, Di is open and honest with everyone.
Best word to describe her: I have no single word that can sum up Di. She’s great. And to be a great technical researcher, you must be comfortable immersing yourself deep in quantitative data. The best researchers are those who, like an AI algorithm, can see a pattern in the data. The next level are those who can link evidence together to fashion a cohesive story. But the very best are those who can then distil the information into a few actions that clients can embrace. Di Shelton is that researcher. She is one of the few people I have encountered that can straddle both advanced qualitative and quantitative research with equal ease.
Most annoying habit or endearing behaviour she has: What do I dislike most about Di? Her judgement. She is consistently right which constantly causes me to remind myself of my shortcomings. No one I have met could match Di for capability, decision making, knowledge and leadership. What I find most endearing is her ability to cut directly to the issue that needs to be resolved. Where most leaders have a degree of running on the spot, Di is logical, decisive and caring. I also love her devotion to and empathy for our clients and her development of the Forethought youngsters.
Diane on Ken:
Most memorable moment with Ken: When we went our separate ways, after initially working together, the always ambitious Ken set up his own shop while I went off to work client side. I was not surprised when he proved immediately that he was going to be successful. What he did when he set up Forethought was something very new in the Australian market. He was able to build a strong, successful business that is based on rigorous and sound first principles and constantly reinvigorate approaches and delivery. And he has been doing this for 30 years plus. That is a phenomenal achievement.
Best word to describe him: Ken is both mercurial and volatile. It goes with the territory of being so highly intelligent and creative. I can seem more measured in comparison, but in fact we are extraordinarily alike. We agree absolutely on the fundamentals of our business and craft. We have an uncanny ability to get to the same spot, albeit via different routes. Our complementary styles have enabled us to be very effective together. Ken can be seen as a bit of a bulldozer, especially when he gets the bit between his teeth, but his reference for me is the velvet bulldozer and he is not wrong.
Most annoying habit or endearing behaviour he has: Coming back into his orbit has been a very unexpected and delightful shift in my life. What’s most endearing is that little has changed and he is still operating at the only pace he knows: flat out. But more than that he is still so innovative and entrepreneurial with new thinking, new approaches and an embracing of new technologies that continues to set Forethought apart (and ahead) of the rest. I am very grateful that he has welcomed me into his world again and that he trusts me with the running of his baby (although he is still very much in presence). I have stepped into an environment that is characterised by intelligence, curiosity, passion and potential in the team I am privileged to lead, and it is Ken who has made this possible.
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Lauren McNamara is a journalist at Mumbrella, covering the creative and PR beat. She joined in November 2022 as editorial assistant, after completing a Bachelor of Communications (Journalism) at UTS.
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I loved Ken’s description about Diane … “The best researchers are those who, like an AI algorithm, can see a pattern in the data.”
I’d back DI over AI.
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